In November, Jesuit Social Services was lucky to host renowned global justice systems expert Dr Baz Dreisinger for a day. An inspiring proponent of restorative justice, Baz founded the Prison-to-College Pipeline program at John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York, and now as Executive Director of Incarceration Nations Network is travelling the world investigating how justice can be done differently. Through her books, documentaries and in the media, Baz advocates for restorative justice and education as a replacement to mass incarceration.
Baz reflected on her day with Jesuit Social Services, where she visited the Ignatius Learning Centre, met with Jesuit Social Services executives and Justice and advocacy program leaders, and toured the Maribyrnong Community Residential Facility.
What are the big issues you’ve seen in Australia on this visit?
The issue of the media and the issue of the negative portrayals of certain targeted, criminalized groups, definitely issues of budget and budget cuts in the space, and just frustrations around funding and support, a feeling of a lack of public buy in for the work, which it all also comes back to media and PR and discourse and the way that things are being expressed. I think the theme of overrepresented groups, always among the thoughtful work here there’s always been an emphasis on Aboriginal people and First Nations people, but now having an emphasis on South Sudanese and other African groups, it was an education for me to learn just how over represented they are in the Victorian criminal justice system, and that’s a terrifying thing. As compared to my last visit, or my last visits, there’s definitely more lived experience leadership, and that’s heartening to see, and I hope that that continues – I think it will.
I hope that it grows to include more lived experience leaders of colour, who are representative of the gross over representation of certain peoples in the criminal justice system here. I hope that that’s the next phase of the work as the lived experience leadership continues to grow and take centre stage here. And I definitely feel like the issue of education, not incarceration, there’s a whole lot of interest in that and I think a ripe moment to be building out on that work with different organisations here, and I hope nationally too, not just I head out to some other places in Australia and so I hope that that momentum is the same there as well.
To me, optimism is a justice worker’s mandate. We have no option but to be optimistic, because we have to think about what we’re building and that requires a level of imagination and vision and at least a belief in endless possibilities.
We have a significant issue here in the media reporting of youth crime. Do you see that kind of damaging coverage everywhere, and how do you combat that?
It’s a universal crisis, it’s the same everywhere. The media loves to sensationalise, the media loves to criminalise particular groups.
I actually even wrote about it in my book in the Australia chapter, in terms of the Rupert Murdoch press and how your tabloids are really powerful, just like in the UK, ours in the US are also that way. They really work to create a brainwashing of the public in terms of demanding punishment, being afraid, being fearful and crippled in a fearful place, which is a really dangerous place to leave the public, because when you’re fearful, you don’t make wise decisions. The way that we combat that is with our media, with our PR, with our work to impact communities and show them that the way is not punishment, that prisons and police are not making us safer, they’re not the answer, and they’re doing the opposite.
I spent quite a bit of time talking about the alleged gang issue here, and that when you hype up the gangs like that, you’re feeding into the problem, and that we need to recognise that this is not an issue about gangs. This is an issue of inclusion and exclusion, and that really we don’t need to be focusing on ‘anti-gang activity’ but rather thinking about ways to build community. To bring people into the fold, to include them in in community and in decision making, and to really be giving autonomy and authority and agency to the people most directly impacted, instead of feeding into what the media wants us to be eating, this diet of punitivity.
What has been your impression of Jesuit Social Services?
JSS has a tremendous footprint and that is really valuable. Even prior to coming in today, JSS came up in almost every meeting. So obviously having that level of reach and that level of presence and that legacy and all of the years of being here is itself hugely valuable.
The restorative justice work that has been ongoing too, not a new thing, but rather an ongoing thing, is really, really valuable. I can appreciate the efforts that JSS makes to be holistic, both in terms of thinking about education, as I was talking about earlier, having this presence in schools, having a school itself, but also in terms of dealing with trying to push policy as well as services, that’s not easy.
It’s a lot. And so I think that trying to cover all that ground is really credit worthy, and noteworthy and also unique. I think overall what I feel is a collaborative spirit.
And a recognition too, that the landscape is changing, and that part of the work for all of us is recognising how we have to change alongside the landscape, and how do we adjust to that and how do we adjust our organisations, how do we adjust our staff and what the work looks like according to the way that the landscape, the justice landscape, is changing. I think there’s an openness to that, which is really, really important.